Peyton Manning's Legacy

[Amen Corner]

Otto Grahm 10 straight championships!

[ItownHosscat]

ZERO Superbowl appearances.....nil....nada...not even a sniff....lol



WHO-DAT!!!!!

[Orange and Brown]

ZERO Superbowl appearances.....nil....nada...not even a sniff....lol



WHO-DAT!!!!!

Who are you talking about???

[seofan_via_dublin]

Otto Grahm 10 straight championships!

ZERO Superbowl appearances.....nil....nada...not even a sniff....lol

Shouldn't be long now, I can feel the Browns fans getting wound up. Just wait for it.....

[Just_A_Fan]

After putting my top 5 QBs on here last night, I have given it more thought. I would prob make it something like this...

It all comes down to winning superbowls

1 Joe Montana...he's got three or four rings
2 Terry Bradshaw...he's got four rings I know he had the steel curtain but
3 Troy Akiman...won three
4 John Elway...won two rings
5 Tom Brady...won three rings

I know I had Steven Young at the #4 spot but I forgot about John Elway

Could we say that Brain Kelly from Buffalo would have been the greatest if Buffalo would have won say 3 out of the 5 times. I often think that he does get over look, but then again no one remembers the losing team.

[Orange and Brown]

After putting my top 5 QBs on here last night, I have given it more thought. I would prob make it something like this...

It all comes down to winning superbowls

1 Joe Montana...he's got three or four rings
2 Terry Bradshaw...he's got four rings I know he had the steel curtain but
3 Troy Akiman...won three
4 John Elway...won two rings
5 Tom Brady...won three rings

I know I had Steven Young at the #4 spot but I forgot about John Elway

Could we say that Brain Kelly from Buffalo would have been the greatest if Buffalo would have won say 3 out of the 5 times. I often think that he does get over look, but then again no one remembers the losing team.

You mean Jim Kelly and he went 0-4 in Super Bowls.

Okay so now to be the greatest or in the discussion you have to have multible rings?
Charles Haley has 5 Super Bowl rings, does that make him the best D tackle of all time?
Answer..... NO!!!!!!!!

You can't judge greatness on Rings alone, there have been great QB's who didn't get a ring. ( See Dan Marino)
I can name 5 Quarter backs that are/were better than Aikman alone. Like I said in an earlier post Brady is a product of the Patriots and Bill Bellicheck.

If Brady had been drafted by any other team he would have been just another QB. I don't think he would have even gotten a good shot for 5 or 6 years.

Manning MAKES the Colts who they are. Without Manning the colts would go 8-8 every year. Without Brady the Pats went 11-5 with a QB who hasn't started since high school. And by the way old Castle isn't so good now that he is away from the Pats.


One more thing; Without Adam Vinitari Brady wouldn't have won as many rings as he did. Those weren't chip shots he kicked. Those were all 30+ yard FG's

[svboy]

Greatest stats of all time but not winning championships which is what every team/player should work toward. Just as many people have talked about Farve being so good but he has won one Super Bowl also. The same amount as the great QB's Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson.

Brett Favre, like Manning & Marino have not been on good teams. It can't be blamed on them. Not one team with one great player in any sport, has won a championship. Kobe Bryant could not win a championship with out good players, same with Michael Jordan, Tom Brady, Ben Roethlisberger, Eli Manning.

AMEN

[3morethan2]

Peyton will still go down as a top 5 quarterback and is bettter than brady
here are my top five
1.Montana
2.Aikman
3.Young
4.Elway
5.Bradshaw

Brady has three superbowls but cmon two of them were on winning field goal kicks and one was because john kasay kicked the ball out of bounds and gave them good field position so its not like brady was lighting it up in any of those games and the year they lost to the giants he did good but when it came down to it lost in the big one

[TripleDouble]

You say the one year Brady had to lead his team by himself to a superbowl that he failed miserably. I believe going 17-1 for the year wouldn't be considered failing miserably. And this past year he is coming off of a knee injury. Brady also had to drive his team down the field in order to get vinatari in position to kick those field goals. I looked up some of Mannings stats from his superbowl run a few years ago. He threw 3 TD's to his 7 interceptions that year. Sounds to me like he didn't carry the team as much as everyone thinks. Their defense played great that year in the playoffs and Joseph Addai was an outstanding back then. He has declined in the past year or so. You can't really say that Manning still would have been great if he was on another team, cause he has never been on another team and neither has Brady. So all we can debate on is their stats and games from the teams that they are on.

[Just_A_Fan]

What are you talking about Brady has completed more passing in a superbowl than any other QB with 32. Without Brady maybe Bill don't have any rings. All QBs are fit for there system, Montana was part of the West Coast offense with Bill Walsh (spelling maybe off). And Terry Bradshaw prob wouldn't have won if he didnt' have that GREAT D. IMO the QB makes the system and the system makes the QB. And Castle got hurt early last year so the word is still out on him, and KC WR are not even on the same page as the Pats WR.

How can having nultible rings not make you in the top 5. I know Dan had all that stats just like Manning does, but you have to win at the end of the day.

[Orange and Brown]

You say the one year Brady had to lead his team by himself to a superbowl that he failed miserably. I believe going 17-1 for the year wouldn't be considered failing miserably. And this past year he is coming off of a knee injury. Brady also had to drive his team down the field in order to get vinatari in position to kick those field goals. I looked up some of Mannings stats from his superbowl run a few years ago. He threw 3 TD's to his 7 interceptions that year. Sounds to me like he didn't carry the team as much as everyone thinks. Their defense played great that year in the playoffs and Joseph Addai was an outstanding back then. He has declined in the past year or so. You can't really say that Manning still would have been great if he was on another team, cause he has never been on another team and neither has Brady. So all we can debate on is their stats and games from the teams that they are on.

It wasn't like he drove them down so he could kick a chip shot. Those were long filed goals.

Every one will see now that the Pats are getting older and the Bellicheck "magic" is starting to wear off that Brady isn't as great as every one thinks he is.
Brady would be nothing without the Pats!!!

[Just_A_Fan]

Plus when Manning won his 1st super bowl is was against Rex Grossman and the Bears. Coming into that week the Bears still didn't know who there QB was.

[farmer]

Greatest stats of all time but not winning championships which is what every team/player should work toward. Just as many people have talked about Farve being so good but he has won one Super Bowl also. The same amount as the great QB's Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson.

Brett Favre, like Manning & Marino have not been on good teams. It can't be blamed on them. Not one team with one great player in any sport, has won a championship. Kobe Bryant could not win a championship with out good players, same with Michael Jordan, Tom Brady, Ben Roethlisberger, Eli Manning.

For years the Colts as a team have been rated a top 5 team. True not one great player can win a championship but what are the big stats if you do not win the championship? The Colts organization has said the regular season does not mean anything it is the playoffs.

When the Colts won the Super Bowl it was the defense which came around at the end of the season and playoffs. The Colts defense is not as bad as some people want to say. The offense does score often and many times quickly. So the defense is on the field more with little breaks and more plays than defenses it is compared to.

Manning hardly ever gets touched. His offensive line protects him as well as Manning throwing quick passes. Manning probably hasn't been touched as much in his career as Big Ben has during the last 2 years. Also with Manning getting $14 million a year with his contract coming up. How much money can a team spend on just one player without taking away from paying for other good players on a team? This year the Colts will have some long time assistant coaches retire. Manning is great but not a QB to constantly win the big game in the playoffs especially when they the favorites to win.

[Orange and Brown]

The Colts lose 1 super bowl and now manning is a choke artist? you people kill me!!!

[farmer]

Some early career choke game stats.
2002: Indianapolis Colts at. New York Jets (41-0 Loss)

Manning: 14 of 31 for 137 yards, zero touchdowns and two interceptions. QB rating: 31.2.

2003: Indianapolis Colts at. New England Patriots (24-14 Loss)

Manning: 23 of 47 for 237 yards, one touchdown and four interceptions. QB rating: 35.5.

2004: Indianapolis Colts at. New England Patriots (20-3 Loss)

Manning: 27 of 42 for 238 yards, zero touchdowns and one interceptions. QB rating: 69.3.

2006: Indianapolis Colts at. Baltimore Ravens (15-6 Win)

Manning: 15 of 30 for 170 yards, zero touchdowns and two interceptions. QB rating: 39.8

Manning has been to 2 Super Bowls during his 12 year career. He is 1 and 1 with his one win against the Bears without much of an offense. Against the Saints he completed a lot of passes but most of them were short passes. He may not choke in all playoff games but the great players have some of the best games during the playoffs. He also could not win the big games while at Tennessee.

He is still not the QB I would want to win the big game.

[2trap_4ever]

He will be listed as one of the top 5 greatest of all time, he will hold all the records and remember people there is one quarterback that is in that top 5 that doesn't have a super bowl ring and only made it to the game one time but no one thinks any less of Dan Marino.

[TripleDouble]

The question I have is why do some people continue to put Marino in their top 5. Top 10 yes, but I wouldn't go top 5. Whether we like it or not, quarterbacks are the only position in football judged differently than the others. They are judged on their stats as well we their championships, since they are suppose to be the team leaders. Not one or the other. A skill position player, or a defensive player can have great stats, not win a ring and still be considered one of the best in their position. Quarterbacks have to have the hardware along with the stats to be considered one of the greats.

[Orange and Brown]

The question I have is why do some people continue to put Marino in their top 5. Top 10 yes, but I wouldn't go top 5. Whether we like it or not, quarterbacks are the only position in football judged differently than the others. They are judged on their stats as well we their championships, since they are suppose to be the team leaders. Not one or the other. A skill position player, or a defensive player can have great stats, not win a ring and still be considered one of the best in their position. Quarterbacks have to have the hardware along with the stats to be considered one of the greats.

Dan Marino is one of the best QB's ever. period!!!!!!

[JChipwood]

Most definitely he (Marino) is one of the best ever!! So is Peyton. Anybody thinking differently or using SB wins to determine greatness is thinking absurdly. 3double uses the 17-1 season to show greatness for Brady but Peyton's SB loss is a choke and diminishes his career achievements. League MVPs may be a better determining factor that SB wins for ANY individual because football is totally a team game and we all agree that defense wins championships. No QB plays defense and most QBs are smart enough to know that their place is not motivating the defense, rather let the coaches coach and prepare and don't bother them or take away from their concentration. Peyton surely gets that philosophy.

[Just_A_Fan]

Not once did I ever say that Manning wasn't a Top Ten, QB or Marino. However, like someone said early the QB spot is judge on the rings that you have and beening a great QB IMO you have to have RINGS key letter is the "S". When the game is on the line and your in the playoffs or superbowl you need someone that will win you the game or get you into field goal range. I am sorry but Marino and Manning are not the top five guys I want. JMO